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Last edited by ww43.; 11-15-2012 at 07:19 PM.
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Last edited by ww43.; 11-15-2012 at 07:19 PM.
ww43, you also did the right thing with your honesty about slipping, and your input here is very much appreciated! Thank you for the HBO link on addiction.
Keep top of mind your relationship with your kids through their teen years will be immeasurably improved by not drinking.
Just pop Ms. AV in the face when she tries to speak up, and keep posting no matter what!
Sue
I am about a week in now going to AA meetings every night at 8. the timing of it certainly helps me keep safe on any given night. one thing that strikes me is this thought, "oh I'm not that bad," after hearing some of these stories. But then a couple guys are more like me ... want to stop but can't, without the jail, divorce, and job loss stories. One thing they talk about: 'yets.' the things we say we will never do WILL eventually occur. I am not that fatalistic but then again I have done things when drinking I would have said that I would never do, a few years before.
The people in the room are highly damaged and that can be a turn-off, and I think it is plum stupid to talk to strangers about financial and medical problems in explicit detail. Still, keeping in mind that I can do with this what I need, and no one can coerce anything (and I am not saying they want to; many just come from much less free-thinking subcultures where obedience is the highest virtue), I really am getting something from the meetings and books.
The book is brilliant. When fed up with any stupidity from the people in the meetings, I look at the book when I get home and it is better.
I would say the 'god thing' is absolutely central to this program, and I might have expected that to bother me, but lo and behold it doesn't. None of the things I dislike about religion are the things emphasized, certainly not in the literature, though some individuals get a bit churchy ... so I don't say anything and who cares? This god thing might even be helping me, to my slight embarrassment. But I don't have to tell anyone and thus jeopardize my liberal cred lol.
All in all it is rewarding. I have shown up every night and am headed out to do it again. I do still cherish the more cerebral side of this that I can get from this forum. I read this every day.
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Last edited by ww43.; 11-15-2012 at 07:20 PM.
Morning of day 26 of my 107 day commitment. How nice it is to really want to give myself this present. I never want anything, I never deserve anything, I am too lazy or selfish to do anything nice for me..... I am feeling good about giving myself this gift and also about receiving it. The work I will put into giving this gift to me is going to be the nicest thing I have ever done for myself and knowing that makes receiving this gift truly the sweetest gift I have ever gotten.
Jeff, Congrats on 9 months! Such an inspiration my friend!
Ken, Hi Buddy!!!! Thank you for your post......being selfish in drinking and being sober does sound like a contradiction but sober selfishness is the way for me...... No guilt in it......there was a lot of guilt in the drunk selfishness...... Glad you shared with us.
TimUK, when I saw your new name it made me think of a funny Brit friend of this forum....AlisonUK! Hope you are doing well Alison and that you are just out training for the next Olympics
Congrats on 41 days! Super Awesome! I am very impressed that you are keeping it together during this dark cloud you are experiencing. Your mates comment about not inviting you last week was low.....but remember his loss! Sober TimUK is now the best he can be so what if the loser likes company in his misery..... Move on!
Yesterday I started a new audio book in my travels...... The Road Less Traveled by M. Scott Peck...... So much useful information! If you haven't heard it (read it), do it. You won't be disappointed (none of you will). I am already through 3 of the 4 CDs.
Julliet, Hope you are ok and find what you need. I'm worried about you.......please remember how beautiful and intelligent you are..... This horrific disease is NOT honest and tries what ever it can to destroy you.....know that we are pulling for you.
Sue, thank you for your post.....it's definately not all sunshine and roses. I am just staying in the moment......no going back (ie getting caught up on how many sober days I have accumilated) and not letting my pschy take me into the future...... My personality always takes me all over the board so staying in the moment and eating only my piece of the elephant has been a huge challenge.....but am totally seeing the benefits!
WW43.....thanks for the meaning behind your name......Super Cute! There's not a single AV army that Wonder Woman can't beat......way to go!
Since thinking about AlisonUK, I also am wondering about Priscilla....How was your dinner? And BDog......How's the puppy doing? And Eric......still thinking about a sober Christmas? And Serenty.......Hope you are still learning new tools to beat this! And my bestie Molly!......Miss you baby! I miss your support and insight.
Welcome all our new friends......Greg, hope you are doing well.
Hi Hope the non-drinker! It's a pleasure to see you here. I can totally relate to feeling like by extending my drinking hour that I did good and could then drink because my thought was I delayed gratification so now I could be rewarded......and because since I delayed the start till so late I didn't drink as much....so good job Beth.....talk about nonsensical!
The book I mentioned above.... The Road Less Traveled...... Talks extensively about discipline. Since I didn't learn it as a kid I was doomed as an adult......but I am determined to learn this new healthy habit and to teach my children this habit.
Nothing about my old ways were(are) working so I am open to learning a new approach. He talks about changing your map.....just how the world map changes.....your individual map needs to change. I am so astonished by my perception of my life......there are so many things in my past that I justified as that's just how life is. My childhood was okay because I was never sexually molested.....so anything I endured wasn't that bad.......But it was bad.....it was not a childhood I would ever wish on my children. But until recently I buried my head in the sand and blamed all my bad choices on myself. Funny how getting to the core and changing this childhood perception is helping figure out so much on my approach to life.
I live a pretty secluded life. I am figuring out I do this so that I won't get hurt. So I have long accepted that I won't experience Joy either....to experience Joy you must experience Pain and that is just something I couldnt bear. So I would just go through life waiting for the day I would die......not something I would wish on anyone.
I can tell you that I am scared as hell to take myself out of this comfort zone.....but I can also tell you by living in this zone, I am already dead.......by not drinking I am now ready to take off this security blanket.
Good morning folks. Day 37.
Very interesting posts. Beth, I know what you mean about trying not to get hurt. I used to do that all the time. I didn't want to go out on a limb and love anyone, as I did not want to get hurt, etc. I used to sing the Eagle's song Desperado all the time, as I thought it described me.
Stay strong folks. Have a wonderful sober day.
Last edited by Millie; 10-11-2012 at 09:34 PM.
Hello all... Geez it's day 10 for me and it's been rough. I love reading the posts here and wake up every morning and grab my laptop so I can get some inspiration from everyone. Seems like a lot of smart and insightful people.. So I fit right in! But really.. can't remember right now who said they feel less fun without the drink but I feel the same. Just can't seem to loosen up without it. Which is why I haven't been able to really get into the aa scene. Everyone seems so eager to share... without alcohol? Really? Think that's why I like this forum. I can hear some great stories and get some great advice while in my robe!
Looking for some good reads as I wait to get into this day treatment. Guess it's a busy time of year! Any suggestions would help! Thank you!
Since Samovar and John brought it up, I can't pass up an opportunity to throw my 2 cents in about AA. I have mostly discussed this in the Getting Started thread, but if you will give AA a chance, it can really help. I give it all the credit in my own success, 100%. The "God" thing and the "powerless" thing are the two biggest hurdles for most people. (It always makes me smile that people (not you two) can get upset talking about God in a forum with "Spiritual" in the title!) If you will attempt to leave your past notions about religion behind and apply the steps to your own definition of "Higher Power," what that term means to you, that is all that is required.
I can honestly say that if you cannot quit own your own, like myself, isn't that the definition of powerlessness? Also, AA talks about, especially in the big book, that drinking is a spiritual problem. That we have an emptiness in our spirit that we are trying to fill with alcohol, but no matter how much you try, alcohol cannot fill a God-sized hole. If you want to quit drinking and have not had success on you own, why not open yourself to the possibility that there might be a power in this never ending universe greater than ourselves that might just lend us a helping hand just for the asking? By the way, it worked for me. I'm not saying it was easy and that it did not require discipline and that I didn't slip on multiple occasions, but when I really committed 100%, all in to AA, I finally got some traction and the relief I had been searching for for so long.
I'll hop down from my soap box now, but please, open yourself up to the possibility that AA might work for you too if give it a shot. I didn't have the strength to do it on my own and I figured if AA has worked for millions of others I might as well give it a shot. It saved my life and I still lean on what I learned there almost everyday. As Samovar said, you only have to reveal what you want in those meetings, no one forces you to do anything. Some people there will get on your last nerve and some you will say, wow, that's my story! AA may not be for you, but it does work if you work "the program" or the steps. You can even do AA completely online. If it is not for you, there are many other paths to the same destination.
Beth, hey there, I agree completely that sober selfishness is the way. Just apply the same selfishness we used when drinking to sobriety!
Last edited by Ken1; 10-11-2012 at 09:40 AM.
"Life is 10 percent what you make it, and 90 percent how you take it. "
-- Irving Berlin
Millie, OMG Desperado was my theme song, sung while sobbing after drinking too much wine. Not any more!
staygold, one suggestion is read lots of Patrick's articles. My list of favorites is posted in the Library thread on the water cooler.
Tim, glad you're still with us.
Glad to see the positive feedback on AA. Here on the spiritual river it's all about what works, drugs or no drugs, AA or no AA, rehab or no rehab, just breaking free.
Quick Patrick quotes: "Spiritual River is all about creating a new life for yourself in recovery. This is best described by the creative theory of recovery". "The winners are the people in recovery who are actively creating a new life for themselves. They are definitely not whining. Instead, they take action. They create. . .(they) come from different programs. Some are in AA and NA. Others do not follow a formal program at all. Some are in churches or religious communities. But all of them are recovering from addiction, and all of them are living the creative theory (whether they know it or not). They have found success in recovery from drugs and alcohol through the creative life...(They)are always creating a positive future for themselves."
Works for me. Have a great day y'all.
Last edited by carol; 10-11-2012 at 10:54 AM.
Hi all
I've been really strong this last week and have not drank. But today my av sounds louder than ever.
The weird thing is that I don't actually want to drink, the idea of the taste the smell Of it makes me want to puke. But in worried about how I feel.
This month is probably the worst for me to stop; it's going to be hectic with 3 close family weddings over the next few weeks meaning lots of people staying over/drinking/mess/(fun) chaos etc. part of me dreads what's coming and questions how strong I am, but the other part says if I can make it through this month, ill be fine.
I've loved how great I feel since stopping - the clarity that I have is unreal. The energy I have it lovely and I was so worried about getting off to sleep but I've been fine.
I house share, and whilst I have no alcohol my room mate has bottles of it in an open cabinet. In the past I used to sneak it and replace it the next day. It makes it so easy.
It was only last night I truly thanked god for the strenght I have had; I still thank him as I am so much stronger.
It's just today I'm feeling slightly towards wantin to drink. In the past one seed of thought about a drink is all it would take. This scares me.
Sorry as I know this seems quite garbled. Just wanted to clear my head I guess
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Last edited by ww43.; 11-15-2012 at 07:21 PM.
Hi everyone. The recent mentions about AA, a higher power and powerlessness reminded me of a discussion on this topic at an AA meeting I attended some time back.
Basically, the speaker was saying it’s okay to find your own individual higher power anywhere and in anything you want. The point he stressed was that it can be whatever you want it to be and the main point being that it helps you to get away from the grip of alcohol. That is, it helps you to do something you seemed incapable (ie powerless) of doing yourself. And by putting your belief in it and relying on it can help you get sober.
As an example of this, he told the story of a guy who was in a real bad way and deeply down the rabbit hole. The guy had no family, no friends, no car, no place of his own and couldn’t function with drinking. Every day he had to walk past a bar on his way home from work, and had tried repeatedly not to go into the bar, but failed over and over.
At AA he struggled completely with the concept of God or a higher power and refused to believe there could ever be anything like this. He agreed with his own powerlessness, but still could not see how a higher power could be there and how it could help him. In this discussion he spoke about how he couldn’t even pass by the bar without going in to drink.
The AA member talking with the guy then remembered the tram (street car) that passed by the bar and he suggested the guy ride the tram as one way of helping him to pass by the bar without going in for a drink!
The guy tried riding the tram and it helped him get home without drinking! And so he subsequently got sober and stayed sober.
The story was along the lines of the tram became the guy’s higher power, in that it helped him do something he couldn’t do himself. It kept him safe and got him home sober every day. It became a symbol to him that there are things in this world that could help him to do things he seemingly could not do himself, and therefore he became willing to trust that there was more to life than just himself.
This analogy has nothing to do with religion or spirituality in the traditional sense, but to do with just allowing oneself to accept that a higher power can be anything that helps you to gain power over alcohol. This seems to be a good thing I think.
Have a great sober day everyone.
Jeff, good morning down there..! great insight on the higher power part... on the subject of aa, i agree that folks can find good things in it if they are willing to focus on those things that bring benefit. my trouble with it was that it wasn't holistic and didn't encourage other good habits. at least in my group, and i admit to not working very hard to find others when i found SR last December... as a runner i wanted to learn how to transfer my destructive habits to my exercise and mental repair. there was too much smoking at my group and that's a trigger. i rationalized, and still do, that if don't subsitute a healthy life for drinking, i may as well keep at it. i too struggled with the higher power part, especially here in the south where everyone thinks it's their business to edge you towards their "right" way.
If one's higher power is a tram, then so be it... those that threw me off balance are the ones who implied that you can go give other things a try but in the end you'll come back to their way. that's so condescending and presumes one right way. my sister and i recently had a huge fight about this and i told her that, much to her dismay, there are atheists in foxholes, and they aren't evil, mean people. all they ask is that they can live their life without intereference. i had no problem with her beliefs until she told me i would change on my deathbed. then it's no punches pulled. btw, i personally have no problem coming to a forum called spiritual because i will define that word however i choose, while not imposing it on any one of you. live and let live.
enough of such musings...... the important thing here is that you are all wonderful people, no matter what you believe. i find the non-judgemental attitudes here to be very refreshing...imagine the alcohol that has been avoided because of the connections here. a truly special group.
have a nice evening, my friends.....
This forum offers help for those in the 'clique' and no one else. There are a select few who have offered supported.
Upon creating new discussion threads I was basically advised its was not the correct thin and I should post in this forum.
I have and am offered no support.
It's a shame as I really did need support this evening.
Hey newstart don't give up on us! I'm currently on a leash at my mom's. Long story. More later, gotta run
Last edited by carol; 10-11-2012 at 03:45 PM. Reason: ArGh, autofill, sorry to make matters worse
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Last edited by ww43.; 11-15-2012 at 07:22 PM.
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Last edited by ww43.; 11-15-2012 at 07:42 PM.
ww43, I completely understand, AA isn't for everyone. There are countless other paths to the same destination. Most of the programs all offer online meetings if you can't tolerate the physical ones. My best advice to anyone is to look at all the approaches and pick over them cafeteria style. When you eat at a cafeteria, you pick and choose only the items that appeal to you. Use this method with the differing sobriety programs out there and with life in general. Apply the advice that works for you, and if you can't get on board with part of a particular program, skip it if you want. The only right way is the one that works for you.
I also wanted to second your statement that we care. Sometimes we may have something on our mind specifically that we need to express besides addressing each post individually, but if someone needs something, ask and you will surely receive! If you are looking for a response, ask for one! Ask a question and I can almost guarantee you that you will receive multiple responses and support! If you phrase your post as a statement, chances are people will read it and move on.
Just as in life, there are all types of people here. I know that there are people that post here regularly that disagree with me and that is fine, the beautiful thing is that we can all co-exist here as ultimately we are fighting the same battle and have the same goal, that's what brought us all here in the first place. I personally am a man of strong faith in God, but I'm certainly not trying to convert anyone. I respect anyone's choice to be agnostic, atheist, or worship anyway they see fit and only wish for the same courtesy in return. We all learn and grow when differing opinions and solutions are offered.
I read a book called "The Traveler's Gift" by Andy Andrews and this quote has stayed with me ever since: "It is irrational to think that other people will always behave the way I want them to. It is unrealistic to expect that people will always act decently and respectfully toward you. Forgiveness is a gift you give yourself. It sets you free." That quote has helped me and I hope it helps someone else. The book is great and you can probably find him presenting it on You Tube as it was a PBS special as well.
Kimber, I wish I could figure out how to add your last two posts to the end of my post here, all I can say is amen sister! Well said!
Last edited by Ken1; 10-12-2012 at 06:35 AM. Reason: spelling
"Life is 10 percent what you make it, and 90 percent how you take it. "
-- Irving Berlin
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